One of the arguments I’ve seen for Jesus existing, or being real, is that people wouldn’t die for his cause if he wasn’t.
This is an extremely weak argument that has been proved wrong so many times that I’m surprised people still use it.
Just because people are willing to die for a belief does NOT make that belief, or the reason behind that belief, true!
For examples within my life time, look no further than David Koresh, who believed himself a final prophet and who with 75 other people died in a standoff with the BATF and FBI. Or Jim Jones, founder of the pseudo-religious organisation Peoples Temple who with 900 others committed suicide in 1978. Then there was the UFO religion headed by Marshall Applewhite who managed to convince 39 followers to commit suicide in 1997.
All of these people were real (there’s documented evidence for them) but there is absolutely no evidence that their beliefs were true, but despite that hundreds of people were willing to commit suicide for those beliefs!
People will believe all sorts of things, just because they are willing to do all sorts of things for those beliefs, including committing suicide (Islamic suicide bombers in America 2001, or Bali in 2002 & 2005) does not necessarily make the ideas behind those beliefs real.
Oh, and if anyone thinks that religious apologetics don’t say anything like what is in the first sentence, I came across similar twice today whilst researching if Jesus was real (thanks to Sam Hilton’s comment on my last post).
This gentleman is either a stud, or a great con-artist.
This Tel Aviv man in his late fifties is living with 32 women with whom he has fathered 89 children, an Israeli television station revealed last week.
The women are subject to strict discipline, but say that they are all living with Goel Ratzon by their own accord.
They are not allowed to communicate with men, be in physical contact with their biological family, eat meat, smoke, drink alcohol or dress immodestly.
But still they love and adore him, they’ve even said they’d commit suicide if any one harmed him.
Ratzon is held by his companions to be the savior (Goel in Hebrew) of the universe, and is attributed godly and supernatural abilities. Many of the women have tattooed his name and portrait on their bodies.
Ah, now we get to the reason – religion. Why is it the women seem to be so happy to subjagate themselves to men in the name of religion?
As someone in the talkback section points out, Goel looks more like he’s 110. I guess having to live with 32 “wives” will do that to you. TIC
Filed under cult, religion
L. Ron Brown over at The Frame Problem has started a CarnivUL of The fraudless. Similar to the Carnival of the Godless, this CarnivUL is specifically for anti-Scientology postings. This is the first CarnivUL and as L. Ron says:
This first CarnivUL(…T) will be dedicated to tracking major developments that have taken place since January in the international protest against the Cult of Scientology, discussing the why of the protest, the who of Anonymous, and compiling some of the best relevant YouTube video produced over the past 3 months.
L. Ron has been doing a top job informing us about the Church of Scientology (CoS), exposing some of Scientology’s many problems and the evil tactics they employ.
I’ve been kind of busy the last few days and will be the next few (I haven’t forgotten your meme WineyMomma) , so L. Ron’s request for me to spread the word of this new CarnivUL of The fraudless means I can help someone out and don’t have to think too much what to write about.
I urge all my readers to have a read of The Frame Problem’s new CarnivUL of The fraudless, there are lots of videos to watch and quite a bit of information. For anyone not familiar with Scientology and Anonymous this will be a good introduction. Anyone already familiar will still find some useful information and links.
The SMH has two articles today on the Twelve Tribes religious sect (or should that be cult?) and how they may be trying to woo recruits at their Common Ground cafe at the Royal Easter Show.
Now I’ll admit I’ve never heard of this sect before, but the second article raises some concerns. The article discusses how children as young as two have been spanked, with a “reed-like stick” up to 60 times in one day. It also mentions how workers work up to 20 hours a day for no pay:
Sometimes you were working 20-hour days, for no pay. There’s plenty of money coming in, but no one who works there ever sees any of it.”
Hmm, a religious sect making lots of money off the members who don’t see any benefits of it, and the leader(s) leading an extravagant lifestyle. Where have I heard that before?
This says it all
But questioning the elders was also strictly prohibited. “We were told that reasoning was the same sin as witchcraft,” he says.
How odd, a religious sect that doesn’t want their followers to reason.