Jesus and David

One of the arguments I’ve seen for Jesus existing, or being real, is that people wouldn’t die for his cause if he wasn’t.

This is an extremely weak argument that has been proved wrong so many times that I’m surprised people still use it.

Just because people are willing to die for a belief does NOT make that belief, or the reason behind that belief, true!

For examples within my life time, look no further than David Koresh, who believed himself a final prophet and who with 75 other people died in a standoff with the BATF and FBI. Or Jim Jones, founder of the pseudo-religious organisation Peoples Temple who with 900 others committed suicide in 1978. Then there was the UFO religion headed by Marshall Applewhite who managed to convince 39 followers to commit suicide in 1997.

All of these people were real (there’s documented evidence for them) but there is absolutely no evidence that their beliefs were true, but despite that hundreds of people were willing to commit suicide for those beliefs!

People will believe all sorts of things, just because they are willing to do all sorts of things for those beliefs, including committing suicide (Islamic suicide bombers in America 2001, or Bali in 2002 & 2005) does not necessarily make the ideas behind those beliefs real.

Oh, and if anyone thinks that religious apologetics don’t say anything like what is in the first sentence, I came across similar twice today whilst researching if Jesus was real (thanks to Sam Hilton’s comment on my last post).

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5 Comments

Filed under atheism, atheist, cult, god, jesus, religion

5 responses to “Jesus and David

  1. “This is an extremely weak argument that has been proved wrong so many times that I’m surprised people still use it.”

    All the other arguments are equally weak, but when you NEED to believe, just about any excuse will do.

  2. I had forgotten about this argument,which was often mentioned from the pulpit when I was growing up. I can’t believe I ever bought it…..then again, I used to believe in the whole resurrection thing, so clearly logic wasn’t exactly being encouraged.

  3. Sam

    Thanks for the post. I agree it is a weak argument on its own. I would only use this argument as part of a more fully orbed argument about the existence of Jesus.

  4. Ever heard someone say they would die/kill for a cigarette/drink

  5. Xtians will say that these people killed themselves, but the disciples were persecuted, tortured, and murdered. I guess the thinking is that they would have confessed if they KNEW it was a lie. Of course, it is sufficient for them to believe and his does not extend to truth.

    Sam, your “orb of Jesus” fails whenever we probe from any direction.

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